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<rfc xmlns:xi="http://www.w3.org/2001/XInclude" ipr="trust200902" docName="draft-carpenter-gendispatch-org-proc-docs-01" category="info" submissionType="IETF" tocInclude="true" sortRefs="true" symRefs="true" version="3">
  <!-- xml2rfc v2v3 conversion 3.23.2 -->
  <front>
    <title abbrev="Process Document Organization">Organization of IETF Process Documents</title>
    <seriesInfo name="Internet-Draft" value="draft-carpenter-gendispatch-org-proc-docs-01"/>
    <author initials="B. E." surname="Carpenter" fullname="Brian E. Carpenter">
      <organization abbrev="Univ. of Auckland">The University of Auckland</organization>
      <address>
        <postal>
          <postalLine>School of Computer Science</postalLine>
          <postalLine>The University of Auckland</postalLine>
          <postalLine>PB 92019</postalLine>
          <postalLine>Auckland 1142</postalLine>
          <postalLine>New Zealand</postalLine>
        </postal>
        <email>brian.e.carpenter@gmail.com</email>
      </address>
    </author>
    <date year="2024" month="October" day="01"/>
    <area>General</area>
    <workgroup>GenDispatch</workgroup>
    <keyword>Internet-Draft</keyword>
    <abstract>
      <?line 44?>

<t>This document suggests that the IETF's many documents related
to process and procedures need to be better organized and
consolidated, and outlines a possible framework for this.</t>
    </abstract>
    <note removeInRFC="true">
      <name>About This Document</name>
      <t>
        Status information for this document may be found at <eref target="https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-carpenter-gendispatch-org-proc-docs/"/>.
      </t>
      <t>
        Discussion of this document takes place on the
        GenDispatch Working Group mailing list (<eref target="mailto:GenDispatch@ietf.org"/>),
        which is archived at <eref target="https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/gendispatch/"/>.
        Subscribe at <eref target="https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/GenDispatch/"/>.
      </t>
    </note>
  </front>
  <middle>
    <?line 50?>

<section anchor="intro">
      <name>Introduction</name>
      <t>The IETF has a large number of documents (mainly RFCs) devoted
to its standard process, its rules and procedures in general,
and how it does its work. Some of these are BCPs, some of them
are Informational RFCs, with occasional Experimental RFCs.
In addition there are IESG Statements for specific topics,
summaries of processes and procedures on the IETF web site,
presentations made at IETF meetings or in educational material,
snippets in email archives, unwritten rules, and external
information such as
<eref target="https://sphericalcowconsulting.com/2024/09/20/more-on-standards-development/">this</eref>.</t>
      <t>At a rough estimate, to have a complete understanding of
IETF processes and procedures, a person would need to consult
about 65 BCPs and RFCs -- there is an 
out of date <eref target="https://www.ietf.org/process/informal/">informal list</eref>.
There are also at least 30 relevant IESG statements.</t>
      <t>This situation is clearly problematic. Obviously it is a
major stumbling block for newcomers. Even for people with
years of IETF participation it can be a source of confusion,
mistakes, and wasted time.</t>
      <t>This draft suggests that at the very least, the IETF needs an
organizing principle or framework for its process and procedural
documents.</t>
      <t>Beyond that it seems desirable to start a project, which would
take many years to complete, of consolidating documents (where
that is feasible) and ensuring that they fit together into
a common framework that will help newcomers and experienced
participants alike.</t>
      <t>Furthermore, a well-maintained guide to the IETF 
process is needed, for newcomers and experienced participants
alike. Maintaining such a guide as part of the IETF web site
would seem appropriate.</t>
    </section>
    <section anchor="framework">
      <name>Framework</name>
      <t>The idea is that process documents would be organized to fit
into one of a set of major topics, with as little overlap as
possible. The following list of topics is only a suggestion.</t>
      <ul spacing="normal">
        <li>
          <t>Workflow in the IETF</t>
        </li>
        <li>
          <t>Bodies involved in the process</t>
        </li>
        <li>
          <t>Document types</t>
        </li>
        <li>
          <t>Standards track documents</t>
        </li>
        <li>
          <t>Review and approval process</t>
        </li>
        <li>
          <t>Intellectual Property Rights</t>
        </li>
        <li>
          <t>Conduct of participants</t>
        </li>
        <li>
          <t>Publication process (RFC Editor)</t>
        </li>
        <li>
          <t>Parameter registration process (IANA)</t>
        </li>
        <li>
          <t>Meetings</t>
        </li>
        <li>
          <t>Administration and support</t>
        </li>
        <li>
          <t>Process for modifying process and procedures</t>
        </li>
      </ul>
    </section>
    <section anchor="consolidation">
      <name>Consolidation</name>
      <t><xref target="I-D.rsalz-2026bis"/> and <xref target="I-D.rsalz-2418bis"/> are good examples
of consolidation. If all the relevant RFCs and IESG statements
could be consolidated in this way, resulting in say 10 or 15
documents fitting into the framework above, future participants
would face much less complexity.</t>
      <t>There is a question of finding the effort to do this. It seems
unlikely that it can be entirely performed on a voluntary basis.
Most of the work is editorial in nature, and could be performed
without any decisions of principle being needed. That implies
that it could be performed as paid work. Any decisions
of principle (such as reconciling inconsistencies between
existing documents, or incorporating an IESG Statement in an
RFC) must of course be subject to IETF review and consensus,
as must the final documents.</t>
    </section>
    <section anchor="guide">
      <name>Guide</name>
      <t>The <eref target="https://www.ietf.org/process/informal/">informal list</eref>
of process-related documents mentioned above
has been present on the IETF web site for many years. Since it
was carefully written not to paraphrase or summarize content,
but only to cite existing documents, it could serve as an
model of how a regularly maintained guide might look.
This maintenance will not involve any decisions of principle.</t>
    </section>
    <section anchor="iana-considerations">
      <name>IANA Considerations</name>
      <t>No IANA actions are needed.</t>
    </section>
    <section anchor="security-considerations">
      <name>Security Considerations</name>
      <t>This document does not directly affect the security of the Internet.</t>
    </section>
    <section anchor="acknowledgements">
      <name>Acknowledgements</name>
      <t>Useful comments were received from
Jay Daley,
Stephen Farrell,
Ted Hardie,
Eliot Lear,
Eric Rescorla,
Rich Salz,
and others.</t>
    </section>
  </middle>
  <back>
    <references anchor="sec-informative-references">
      <name>Informative References</name>
      <reference anchor="I-D.rsalz-2026bis">
        <front>
          <title>The Internet Standards Process</title>
          <author fullname="Rich Salz" initials="R." surname="Salz">
            <organization>Akamai Technologies</organization>
          </author>
          <author fullname="Scott O. Bradner" initials="S. O." surname="Bradner">
            <organization>SOBCO</organization>
          </author>
          <date day="5" month="September" year="2024"/>
          <abstract>
            <t>   This memo documents the process used by the Internet community for
   the standardization of protocols and procedures.  It defines the
   stages in the standardization process, the requirements for moving a
   document between stages and the types of documents used during this
   process.  It also addresses the intellectual property rights and
   copyright issues associated with the standards process.

   This document obsoletes RFC2026, RFC5657, RFC6410, RFC7100, RFC7127,
   RFC7475, RFC8179, RFC8789, and RFC9282.  It updates RFC5378, RFC5657.
   It also updated RFC7475, and with [bis2418], obsoletes it.

            </t>
          </abstract>
        </front>
        <seriesInfo name="Internet-Draft" value="draft-rsalz-2026bis-10"/>
      </reference>
      <reference anchor="I-D.rsalz-2418bis">
        <front>
          <title>IETF Working Group Guidelines and Procedures</title>
          <author fullname="Rich Salz" initials="R." surname="Salz">
            <organization>Akamai Technologies</organization>
          </author>
          <author fullname="Scott O. Bradner" initials="S. O." surname="Bradner">
            <organization>SOBCO</organization>
          </author>
          <date day="9" month="September" year="2024"/>
          <abstract>
            <t>   The Internet Engineering Task Force (IETF) has responsibility for
   developing and reviewing specifications intended as Internet
   Standards.  IETF activities are organized into working groups (WGs).
   This document describes the guidelines and procedures for formation
   and operation of IETF working groups.  It also describes the formal
   relationship between IETF participants WG and the Internet
   Engineering Steering Group (IESG) and the basic duties of IETF
   participants, including WG Chairs, WG participants, and IETF Area
   Directors.

   This document obsoletes RFC2418, and RFC3934.  It also includes the
   changes from RFC7475, and with [bis2026], obsoletes it.  It also
   includes a summary of the changes implied in RFC7776 and incorporates
   the changes from RFC8717 and RFC9141.

            </t>
          </abstract>
        </front>
        <seriesInfo name="Internet-Draft" value="draft-rsalz-2418bis-05"/>
      </reference>
    </references>
    <?line 168?>

<section anchor="change-log-rfc-editor-please-remove">
      <name>Change Log [RFC Editor: please remove]</name>
      <section anchor="draft-00">
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          </li>
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      </section>
      <section anchor="draft-01">
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            <t>Early comments incorporated</t>
          </li>
        </ul>
      </section>
    </section>
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