From bernie@ietf.hoeneisen.ch Mon Jan 13 06:32:19 2014 Return-Path: X-Original-To: enum@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: enum@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E2A9E1ADFA9 for ; Mon, 13 Jan 2014 06:32:19 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 0.262 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.262 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_50=0.8, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.538] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id cqtemNTWc2fm for ; Mon, 13 Jan 2014 06:32:16 -0800 (PST) Received: from softronics.hoeneisen.ch (softronics.hoeneisen.ch [62.2.86.178]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 902641ADF92 for ; Mon, 13 Jan 2014 06:32:16 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]) by softronics.hoeneisen.ch with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1W2iYk-0005eu-JE for enum@ietf.org; Mon, 13 Jan 2014 15:32:10 +0100 Date: Mon, 13 Jan 2014 15:32:10 +0100 (CET) From: Bernie Hoeneisen X-X-Sender: bhoeneis@softronics.hoeneisen.ch To: IETF ENUM list Message-ID: User-Agent: Alpine 2.00 (DEB 1167 2008-08-23) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: MULTIPART/Mixed; BOUNDARY="37663318-982885121-1389623006=:19715" Content-ID: X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 127.0.0.1 X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: bernie@ietf.hoeneisen.ch X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No (on softronics.hoeneisen.ch); SAEximRunCond expanded to false Subject: [Enum] Expert Review draft-goix-appsawg-enum-acct-uri: Approved X-BeenThere: enum@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Enum Discussion List List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 13 Jan 2014 14:32:20 -0000 This message is in MIME format. The first part should be readable text, while the remaining parts are likely unreadable without MIME-aware tools. --37663318-982885121-1389623006=:19715 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII; FORMAT=flowed Content-ID: Dear ENUM list Please be informed that after all issues could be resolved with the authors, the document draft-goix-appsawg-enum-acct-uri-06 has been expert approved. Please find the expert review document in the attachment. All the best, Bernie, IESG Designated Expert for ENUM -- http://ucom.ch/ Tech Consulting for Internet Technology --37663318-982885121-1389623006=:19715 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; NAME=er-acct.txt Content-Transfer-Encoding: BASE64 Content-ID: Content-Description: Content-Disposition: ATTACHMENT; FILENAME=er-acct.txt Ly9TdGFydCBvZiBFeHBlcnQgUmV2aWV3IERvY3VtZW50Ly8NCg0KRXhwZXJ0 IFJldmlldyBvZjogSUFOQSBSZWdpc3RyYXRpb24gZm9yIEVudW1zZXJ2aWNl ICdhY2N0Jw0KRG9jdW1lbnQgTmFtZTogZHJhZnQtZ29peC1hcHBzYXdnLWVu dW0tYWNjdC11cmktMDYudHh0DQpEb2N1bWVudCBMb2NhdGlvbjogaHR0cDov L3Rvb2xzLmlldGYub3JnL2h0bWwvZHJhZnQtZ29peC1hcHBzYXdnLWVudW0t YWNjdC11cmktMDYNCg0KRGF0ZSBSZXZpZXcgU3RhcnRlZCAob24gcmV2aXNp b24gLTA2KTogMTMuIEphbiAyMDE0DQpEYXRlIFJldmlldyBDb21wbGV0ZWQ6 IDEzLiBKYW4gMjAxNA0KUmV2aXNpb246IDEuMCBbMjAxMy0wMS0xM10NCg0K UmV2aWV3IENvbmR1Y3RlZCBCeTogQmVybmllIEhvZW5laXNlbiA8YmVybmhh cmQuaG9lbmVpc2VuQHVjb20uY2g+DQoNCi0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0t LS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tDQpFeHBlcnQncyBOb3RlOiBUaGlz 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from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id G4EU1OUW8who for ; Mon, 13 Jan 2014 07:09:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from office.denic.de (office.denic.de [IPv6:2a02:568:122:16:1::3]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6021F1AE094 for ; Mon, 13 Jan 2014 07:09:11 -0800 (PST) Received: from x27.adm.denic.de (x28.fra2.if.denic.de [10.122.64.17]) by office.denic.de with esmtp id 1W2j8N-0005RU-Qb; Mon, 13 Jan 2014 16:08:59 +0100 Received: from localhost by x27.adm.denic.de with local id 1W2j8N-0007iR-Md; Mon, 13 Jan 2014 16:08:59 +0100 Date: Mon, 13 Jan 2014 16:08:59 +0100 From: Peter Koch To: Bernie Hoeneisen Message-ID: <20140113150859.GB23573@x28.adm.denic.de> Mail-Followup-To: Bernie Hoeneisen , IETF ENUM list References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.2.3i Sender: Peter Koch Cc: IETF ENUM list Subject: Re: [Enum] Expert Review draft-goix-appsawg-enum-acct-uri: Approved X-BeenThere: enum@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Enum Discussion List List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 13 Jan 2014 15:09:16 -0000 Bernie, > Please be informed that after all issues could be resolved with the > authors, the document draft-goix-appsawg-enum-acct-uri-06 has been expert > approved. it's been a while that i read and commented on a very early version, so here's a question. How would this paragraph in section 7 be interpreted: Users MUST therefore carefully consider the information provided in the resource identified by the ENUM record as well as in the record itself. Considerations SHOULD include serving information only to entities of the user's choice and/or limiting the comprehension of the information provided based on the identity of the requestor. Normative language is a bit tricky when it comes to directing human, especially end user, behaviour. In this particular case, it seems to suggest the user acts as a publisher (or, say, zone maintainer) and also seems to encourage selective publication even in the public ENUM tree? -Peter From lconroy@insensate.co.uk Mon Jan 13 09:05:34 2014 Return-Path: X-Original-To: enum@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: enum@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 946091AE0E0 for ; Mon, 13 Jan 2014 09:05:34 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.44 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.44 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.538, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id CVf0d9kFRvdC for ; Mon, 13 Jan 2014 09:05:32 -0800 (PST) Received: from insensate.co.uk (norman.insensate.co.uk [81.174.156.22]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0203F1ADFA3 for ; Mon, 13 Jan 2014 09:05:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by insensate.co.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4CF4D12005E1; Mon, 13 Jan 2014 17:05:20 +0000 (GMT) Received: from insensate.co.uk ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psyche.insensate.co.uk [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id MJm0Pu+zssWP; Mon, 13 Jan 2014 17:05:19 +0000 (GMT) Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by insensate.co.uk (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 8B63D12005D6; Mon, 13 Jan 2014 17:05:19 +0000 (GMT) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1085) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: Lawrence Conroy In-Reply-To: <20140113150859.GB23573@x28.adm.denic.de> Date: Mon, 13 Jan 2014 17:05:18 +0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <748A8106-F79C-4DD7-AB53-DCB29388E16C@insensate.co.uk> References: <20140113150859.GB23573@x28.adm.denic.de> To: Peter Koch X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1085) Cc: IETF ENUM list , Bernie Hoeneisen Subject: Re: [Enum] Expert Review draft-goix-appsawg-enum-acct-uri: Approved X-BeenThere: enum@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Enum Discussion List List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 13 Jan 2014 17:05:34 -0000 Hi Peter, Bernie, folks, OK --- I guess your concern is 2119 style commands to humans? Re. user role -- well, a user who wants to tell people his/her account = may well NOT be a zone maintainer, but his/her choice may well control = the behaviour of the zone maintainer. Given the level of self-publication of PII on web services [like twitter = or facebook] that the general populace seems to be happy to do, it's = fairly obvious that we can tell them, but they may well not listen. However, we can at least give the 2119-like uses as strong advice to any = publisher (but, as in all things, IANAL and nor is anyone else here). How else could we stress that these concerns really, definitely, should = be on the user's list of things to think about? If (say) a carrier or SNEW provider wants to use this scheme to publish = acct data for users, then it really has to consider what data is = published in DNS (and so is available to all). If not, and it has the joy of being in EU jurisdictions, it might (just = might) be sued under national embodiments of the EU Data Protection = Directive. So ... the user choice ("yes please tell the world my account name") may = well require the potential publisher to say "did you REALLY mean that?" = to get legal cover. I can also imagine a carrier being more comfortable limiting publication = using a split-horizon DNS model (as in the two examples in the doc). One set of data for my systems because I'm liable for those anyway, with = another for brother carriers to query; a private and semi-private ENUM = scheme. Re. public ENUM: concern on limiting publication of PII is not specific = to this doc -- it's general to any RRSET. We DID discuss advice on limiting PII publication in ENUM (and so in = public ENUM); honest. I have to admit, it didn't make it into 5483 or 6116, as (at the time) = Security Considerations didn't really extend to privacy. Sigh. It is, however, a requirement in 6117 -- if it wasn't mentioned in the = acct Enumservice document, Bernie would have had to ask for it to be = added. all the best, Lawrence On 13 Jan 2014, at 15:08, Peter Koch wrote: > Bernie, >=20 >> Please be informed that after all issues could be resolved with the=20= >> authors, the document draft-goix-appsawg-enum-acct-uri-06 has been = expert=20 >> approved. >=20 > it's been a while that i read and commented on a very early version, = so here's > a question. How would this paragraph in section 7 be interpreted: >=20 > Users MUST therefore carefully consider the information provided in > the resource identified by the ENUM record as well as in the record > itself. Considerations SHOULD include serving information only to > entities of the user's choice and/or limiting the comprehension of > the information provided based on the identity of the requestor. >=20 > Normative language is a bit tricky when it comes to directing human, > especially end user, behaviour. In this particular case, it seems to = suggest > the user acts as a publisher (or, say, zone maintainer) and also seems = to encourage > selective publication even in the public ENUM tree? >=20 > -Peter > _______________________________________________ > enum mailing list > enum@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/enum