Subject: RE: FW: I-D ACTION:draft-dusseault-dav-quota-01.txt

From: "Clemm, Geoff" <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 13:20:41 -0400

Apple's existing properties should not conflict with DAV:quota or
DAV:quotaused, since they shouldn't be in the DAV: namespace (surely Apple
would not have defined non-standard properties in the DAV: namespace :-).
 
Cheers,
Geoff 

-----Original Message-----
From: Jim Luther [mailto:[email-masked]]
Sent: Thursday, October 24, 2002 12:43 PM
To: [email-masked]
Subject: Re: FW: I-D ACTION:draft-dusseault-dav-quota-01.txt

On Thursday, October 24, 2002, at 09:23 AM, Clemm, Geoff wrote: 

There is a 

separate question of whether the units should to appear in the 

property name ... I'd probably leave it off, for uniformity with 

the rest of HTTP (it is the "Length" header, not the "Octet-Length" 

header). 

I like having the unit type in the name because it makes the purpose of the
property more self-described. 

However, I'm not opposed to removing the unit types from the new property
names as long the property names are NOT quota and quotaused -- using quota
and quotaused would break Apple's existing server and client
implementations. Existing Mac OS X clients use quota and quotaused and
expect the unit size to be 512-bytes and that's what the Apple iDisk server
returns for quota and quotaused. 

- Jim

---

From: Jim Luther <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 12:01:05 -0700

On Thursday, October 24, 2002, at 10:20 AM, Clemm, Geoff wrote:

> DAV:quotaused, since they shouldn't be in the DAV: namespace (surely  
> Apple would not have defined non-standard properties in the DAV:  
> namespace :-).

On Thursday, October 24, 2002, at 10:25 AM, Julian Reschke wrote:

> WebDAV properties are identified using namespaces. Just do not add
> properties in namespaces you don't control.

Surely I wouldn't do that (because I've read the RFC and understand how  
to add non-standard properties to a namespace Apple owns -- for  
example, http://www.apple.com/webdav_fs/props/). However, Apple had  
already shipped products using non-standard properties in the DAV:  
namespace before I had anything to do with WebDAV.

I asked Lisa to revive the "Quota and Size Properties for DAV  
Collections" draft because:
(a) I think quotas are useful and
(b) I knew that Apple had done the wrong thing by using quota and  
quotaused in the DAV: namespace and I want to correct that problem as  
quickly as possible.

So... I'm asking forgiveness and asking that the new names don't  
conflict with those Apple already uses. As I noted in an earlier  
message, we fully plan to support the new properties as soon as it  
looks like they are fully defined and won't change.

By the way, you'll find the same problem with the non-standard  
properties defined by Microsoft including DAV:ishidden which has been  
recently discussed on this mailing list [1].

Does anyone else have any non-standard properties in the DAV: namespace  
to pull out of their closets? It would be nice to know about them now  
rather than later when there's a conflict.

- Jim

[1]  
<http://www.greenbytes.de/tech/webdav/draft-hopmann-collection-props- 
00.txt> and <http://www.greenbytes.de/tech/webdav/webdavfaq.html>

---

From: "Julian Reschke" <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 21:16:46 +0200

> From: [email-masked]
> [mailto:[email-masked]]On Behalf Of Jim Luther
> Sent: Thursday, October 24, 2002 9:01 PM
> To: [email-masked]

Jim,

I didn't want to imply that it was you who did that. But obviously somebody
else did :-)

> quotaused in the DAV: namespace and I want to correct that problem as

That's a good thing.

> recently discussed on this mailing list [1].

Yes. There are many more in use (or actually not in use, but appearing in
PROPFIND requests) at Microsoft. But that shouldn't be an excuse to copy
this behaviour.

BTW: DAV:ishidden was documented in an Internet Draft that at some point
wasn't updated and therefore expired. It probably was intended to be
published as WG RFC at a later point of time. Lesson: do not use the DAV:
namespace in Internet Drafts, unless they are WebDAV working group drafts
(hint hint).

[1] <http://greenbytes.de/tech/webdav/draft-hopmann-collection-props-00.txt>

> ...

Julian

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